Episode 8: What 9th and 10th Graders Can Do Now to Prepare to Apply

Episode 8 Transcript

• Episode 8 Transcript

  [00:00:07] BW: Welcome to College Admissions Insider, the podcast where we talk to real college admissions counselors to bring you expert advice for your college search. I am Bryan Wendell from Bucknell University.

  [00:00:16] BT: I am Brooke Thames, also from Bucknell University. Our goal is to cut through all the fluff to give you everything you need to start, continue, or complete your college search.

  [00:00:25] BW: You know, Brooke, when I think back, I think the second biggest transition in my life after moving from high school to college was the transition from middle school to high school. Because for me, ninth grade was just so much different from eighth grade. Not just because I had gotten my braces off the summer before.

  [00:00:41] BT: Which I’m sure was a very big deal.

  [00:00:43] BW: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

  [00:00:44] BT: Yeah, I totally hear you on that transition. After eighth grade, it was really like things are starting to get serious. Everything started to really count: the classes that you take, the activities that you do, and the grades on all your tests and assignments. Everything has the potential to help or hurt you in the future when you get to applying to college. All of that, plus ninth grade is when your parents and teachers and counselors are all expecting you to start thinking about your college plans.

  [00:01:09] BW: Right, right. Today’s episode is all about those ninth- and tenth-grade years. We know that we’ve seen a lot out there for juniors and seniors and high school, and that makes sense that there’d be a lot of material directed at them since they’re making those final preparations. Today, we wanted to rewind and talk about which should happen before all that.

  [00:01:29] BT: Our guest today is Carrine Gadoury, a Bucknell alum, who is now an admissions counselor at Bucknell. Among her many responsibilities, Carrine works with students and families from Connecticut, Kansas, Missouri, Central New York, Oklahoma and Texas. Welcome to the podcast, Carrine.

  [00:01:45] CG: Thank you so much. It’s a pleasure to be here.

  [00:01:47] BW: We’re so glad to have you here. I know on this podcast, we’ve talked a lot about building a college list and finding those 10, or 20, or however many schools that interest you and then learning more about each one. In your experience, where should ninth and tenth graders fall in that process of building a list? Are they adding more schools? Should they be narrowing it down at that point, or is it some sort of mix of both?

  [00:02:12] CG: Absolutely. Especially for ninth and tenth graders, you are going to have a fairly flexible schedule and a lot of time to devote to your various different interests and passions. I would say, in my advice, you’re going to have that time. Use that time to choose colleges to add to your list. Not necessarily winding it down or narrowing it down. Choose colleges that you think might be interesting to you and then come potentially your tenth-grade year — even to the end of tenth grade, beginning of junior year — that would be a great time to really hunker down and then examine that list to choose which ones might interest you the best to further do some research there.

  [00:02:48] BT: Yeah, and a big part of choosing a college is having some idea of what major a student wants to go into, or at least what careers might interest them after college. Some ninth and tenth graders have big dreams of what exactly what they want to do, but others don’t really know just yet. Let’s start with that first group. For students with a specific plan in mind, where do they begin looking at schools that might be a good fit for them?

  [00:03:13] CG: Definitely. I can attest that I was this type of student when I was in ninth and tenth grade. I knew that I wanted to be a rocket scientist, and I was going to work for NASA one day. Turns out, that’s not what my future career plans were.

  But for those of you that do have that mindset, you know exactly what you want to do, I have a couple of recommendations. The first would be to utilize some of the online platforms. Through College Board, there is a service called Big Future. It’s a really great resource to search for colleges based on your major, based on where they’re located in the United States as well as across the globe, the size of that college, what the testing profile is like. Do they require test scores? Do they not? What are the sports that are offered? Are they division one, division two, division three? As well as what you can expect for financial aid.

  That’s a really great way to search for schools based on major, or any of the other filters you would wish and really see where and what pops up for you. As well as a lot of us in terms of looking for colleges, US news college search is a really large one and has a lot of good information. They do the same as Big Future, where they rank schools based off of size, based off of majors, as well as in their respective fields.

  I always like to provide a disclaimer, especially for the US college news, is that those rankings based off of how many survey results they’re getting back from current students. Those rankings might not be as official or as accurate as we are expecting and hoping them to be.

  My other recommendation would be to utilize your school counselor. Go down to the guidance office, go to school counselor’s office and just pop your head in and say hello. They are an amazing resource that has a plethora of knowledge. They’ll be able to talk to you and share their insights about maybe where some of your classmates are looking, or where have previous students gone from that specific high school. They can share and help to kickstart your process with that major in mind.

  Then last but not least, your community members could potentially provide resources for you. Maybe you’re interested in becoming a doctor, or a vet, or maybe you want to go into the business world. Is there a community member that you could potentially shadow for a day, and you could get a feel for what that job and what that career looks like? Whether it’s a day, or the two weeks, or maybe even something during the summertime. That would be a great way to take that idea that you have and pursue it a little bit further.

  [00:05:31] BT: Yeah, those are all really great resources. I especially like the idea of talking to community members. It’s never too early to have a fun shadowing experience. Well, for those other students, the other group that might not know or have a clue what they want to do, what’s your advice for them who have a lot of interests maybe, but haven’t pinpointed exactly what they want to pursue?

  [00:05:49] CG: Yeah, I definitely want to preface by saying that if you fall into this category, it is okay to be undecided as a ninth and tenth grade student. It’s okay to not know what you want to do for the rest of your life. We get it. You still have time to decide. I would definitely echo my previous recommendations of using those online platforms to see, “Well, maybe I’m interested in history, but maybe I also have a passion for creative writing, and I also want to combine that with something in music.”

  Look at those different schools that offer those majors. Maybe there is a place…like Bucknell for example, has a liberal arts college where you could pursue those various different interests altogether with a double major or a triple major. I would also encourage you to use your school counselor. They’ve dealt countless times with other students who might not have known what they wanted to do and they can give you some really good insight, as well as where to start.

  Sometimes they have those personality quizzes, or career quizzes that you can take that can potentially provide information to you about how your results could potentially line up with a potential career field. As well as, again, shadowing the community members could also be a great way for you to experience that and get a feel.

  In addition, I would also say to utilize your school curriculum and activities. As a ninth as well as a tenth grader, you’re going to have the opportunity to dabble in different courses. I would say use that to your advantage. If you know that you enjoy the sciences, or you know that you enjoy the humanities, which is anywhere from English to history, you can take various different classes in those respective departments and those respective areas and really get a feel for, “Okay, I took this history class and this English class. Out of the two, I really enjoyed the history, more than I enjoyed the English.” That could potentially help to steer you in a potential major/career direction.

  Then as well in regards to the activities, again, you’re going to have a plethora of options regarding whatever high school context you’re in, choose different clubs that might interest you. Maybe it’s a more medical-oriented club, or maybe it’s a community service-oriented club. That could give you insight as to maybe you want to work for a non-profit one day, or maybe you do want to become a doctor. Those would be great resources to utilize.

  [00:07:58] BW: Seems like a great time to make those realizations in high school when there’s still some time to pivot. Not that you can’t change your major in college, obviously. In high school, you can really experience a lot of different things. That’s great advice.

  I know you hear from high school students in your role as an admissions counselor. How many of those are ninth- or tenth-grade students? Are they already contacting you? Then as a follow-up to that is, I know some schools record a prospective student’s, what they call, “demonstrated interest” and actually get credit in some way when looking at their application for being in touch with that school. Do those demonstrated interest touch points, you might call them, do they count for ninth and tenth graders? Do they account that early on?

  [00:08:41] CG: Yeah, I’ll be honest with you in saying that I don’t get too many emails from ninth graders in my inbox throughout the year, as well as sophomores, tenth graders. It’s really a hit or amiss. I might get a handful, maybe at most, 10 a year. Very small interactions in that regard, but that doesn’t mean that we don’t want to see it. We are more than happy to answer your questions that you do have, or even if you just want to say hello, we are happy to respond to you.

  If we do get those emails from ninth or tenth graders, yes, we do count that as demonstrated interest. We will put it into our system’s file. Every college or university has their own online system that they use for that, but we will put that interaction in to say, “Yeah, they reach out as a freshman in high school. They were really excited. They wanted to know more.” Definitely.

  [00:09:26] BW: It sounds like I know the answer to this next question, but just to confirm, it’s never really too early for students to start contacting you. Is that what I’m hearing?

  [00:09:35] CG: Absolutely. Never too early. We always love interacting with families and students, and we want to be a resource for you. I will say that I think it’s always helpful, at least on our end from the admission’s perspective, to email us with a question, or to email us with a concern or idea. Don’t just say like, “Hi, my name is Carrine. I am interested in studying animal behavior and I really love animals.”

  As the admissions counselor, I’m like, “That’s great. I love that you have that passion. I’m really excited that you want to know more about animal behavior. What else can I do for you? Do you want to be in contact with a professor? Would you like to be in contact with a student?” I know when we’re ninth and tenth graders, we’re not really thinking about that. Even if you just want to ask a question like, “Why are you working at Bucknell? Or how was your experience as a student on campus? Or do you know anyone who’s majoring in this that I could talk to?” Those are really great ways that we can engage further in communication with you.

  [00:10:28] BT: Yeah. Speaking of college majors, going back to that a little bit, some universities and majors only admit students who have completed a certain number of qualifying courses in high school. At Bucknell, math, science and engineering applicants need three years of college prep mathematics, I believe. How can students make a four-year high school plan for knocking out courses that they might need even if they haven’t compiled a concrete list of schools that they want to apply to?

  [00:10:54] CG: Yeah, absolutely. Well, I will first say, finish your high school curriculum first. That is utmost important. We want you to graduate from high school before you can start attending colleges. But I would consider a major that you’re potentially interested in studying. For example, if you’re interested in something in the STEM area, you might want to consider taking rigorous courses in math and sciences just to show that you’ve been challenged in those areas.

  If you’re applying for, let’s say, engineering, and you’ve taken a lot of art classes, we as an admission side will say, “Okay, well where is the math and science though? What are you doing that’s preparing you to be successful or to be able to make that jump from high school to college?” As well as, maybe you’re interested in the humanities. Are you taking advantage of the honor’s level, or AP level, or IB depending on the school that you go to? Are you taking advantage of those rigorous courses to, again, prepare you and challenge you in those respective areas?

  I will say, regardless of whatever college you apply to, colleges like to see that you’ve been challenged. If you fall into that “I am not sure what I want to major in yet” group — which is still absolutely okay — maybe take a range of classes, a rigorous range of classes. Maybe you take a rigorous math class, and a rigorous science class, and then maybe a rigorous history class. That’s what you do because that’s what you’re interested in, and you’re like, “I’m so going to be a well-rounded student. I’m still taking advantage of the rigorous curriculum, and I’m going to figure it out once I do get to college.”

  [00:12:23] BW: As a follow-up to that, even if a student is getting maybe As and Bs, instead of all As…If the course work is more challenging and rigorous as you say, that’s seen as a positive when you’re reviewing applications?

  [00:12:38] CG: Absolutely, yes.

  [00:12:39] BW: Okay. So speaking of applications, standardized test are next on my mind here. I know that Bucknell went test optional in 2019, and more and more schools have followed suit since then. Still, the PSAT, SAT and ACT are available and still super important for a lot of students. I’m curious what you recommend for ninth and tenth graders specifically, who want to prepare and familiarize themselves with these tests.

  [00:13:10] CG: Yeah. I know some schools, at least I remember the high school that I went to, we actually had an SAT prep class. I know many different high schools across the nation will have SAT- or ACT-oriented prep classes for students to take. If your high school does offer that curriculum, I would definitely recommend looking into making sure that that’s something that you schedule. Sometimes it is mandated and required as part of your graduation requirements. Other times, it is an elective or it’s optional. So if that’s something that you want to spearhead and start early, that would be a great place to look. Again, talk to your school counselor about that.

  I would also recommend interacting with your school counselor because, again, they might have those SAT prep books — those huge books that weigh a couple of pounds — and they could be able to photocopy or even lend you that book so that way you could have some practice rounds under your belt. There are also really great online, free prep classes or prep-oriented programs that you could tune into.

  I know through College Board and through Khan Academy, they have really great SAT practice plans where you can practice the math section, or practice a writing section, as well as practice those vocabulary words that you always have to know and memorize for the SAT. Just dedicating 15 minutes a day to do one of those plans or programs would do you exceptionally well. There are also ACT programs [of a] similar setting through the online platforms that you could utilize.

  I will say that I remember when I was a sophomore in high school, my grandmother bought me one of those 365-day words a day. It’s basically those pull-off calendars, and it was a new word a day. As silly as it was, I learned a new word every single day, and I was able to broaden my vocabulary through that experience. It was a silly Christmas gift, but it still worked and helped me in the long run.

  Jokes aside, that could potentially be a great resource to utilize. As well as you can buy and purchase books through your local bookstore that can also help you prepare for respective exams.

  [00:15:11] BT: Let’s talk a little bit about outside of high school. As much time as students spend in a classroom, they’re also doing really cool and amazing things outside of the classroom as well. Jobs, internships, volunteering, other extra curriculars like sports. I know schools like Bucknell, really look for that. We want to see students who are exploring their interests and really passionate about those. I am curious what general advice you might have for extracurricular involvement for ninth and tenth graders.

  [00:15:37] CG: Yeah. Similar to what I mentioned a little bit earlier about how you can utilize your curriculum because you’ll have a flexible schedule, I would also say you’re going to have flexible time your ninth and tenth grade years where you might not have rigorous courses yet — where you still have a couple of hours until you get home from school to dedicate to different activities and programs.

  I would say, use that flexible schedule to really think about different clubs and organizations that you could potentially join. And join a lot, or join a little, and just see how you feel once you’re in that respective organization or club.

  [00:16:12] BT: Out of curiosity, is there anything that really stands out on an application? Does doing volunteer work for organizations stand out more than maybe being in the same sport for four years? Or is everything looked at as…Are you just really looking for students who are passionate about what they’re doing?

  [00:16:28] CG: Yeah. My colleagues and I, when we’re reviewing applications, we really enjoy seeing both quality and quantity in regards to your extracurricular activities. I will say that there’s no right way or wrong way when it comes to those respective activities. I know oftentimes we’re drilled inside of our head that we need to be involved in every single club that your schools offered. That’s not necessarily true. If you have all of those passions, and you want to get involved in as many clubs as your school offers, that’s great. Please still eat and please still sleep at night, because you’re going to have a limited amount of time.

  If you’re a type of student where you know where your passions are aligned, and you know that maybe you really enjoy volunteering with the local nursing home in your local community, and you also really enjoy reading books, so maybe you’re part of the books club at school, and then maybe something else…That shows passion. That shows dedication over a numerous amount of years, whether you’ve done it ever since you were little and you’re continuing to do so, or maybe you just started freshman year, and you really enjoyed that, and you want to keep going all the way up until your senior year.

  As much as we say, yes, we want to see quantity, we also want to see the quality as well. Are you dedicating your time for a long-ish period of time, but also doing something that interests you and you’re really passionate about?

  [00:17:42] BW: If we can go back even before ninth and tenth grade for a second…For listeners who might have maybe multiple children — maybe one is in middle school or even a listener is in middle school themselves — is there advice on how they can maximize their chances of getting into that dream school, even that early on? They’ve got the pennant for whatever university up on the wall of their room and have forever, and they’ve got their sights set on it. Because we know, if they’re listening, they’ve already completed that first step, right? They’re thinking about it. What is the next step in your mind?

  [00:18:16] BT: Yeah, in addition to thinking about curriculum, thinking about testing policies, as well as your extra-curricular activities, I would provide just some regular, old advice. One would be to establish good study habits. I know when we’re looking at applications, we’re looking at your grades from all four years across high school. I would say look at, potentially, how you study right now as a eighth grader and think about what high school is going to be like.

  Are you the type of person that writes down all of your notes on a flash card and then you use the flash cards to study? Are you a type of person that likes to type your notes? Maybe think about writing them instead because data shows that writing down your own notes, actually, is a little bit more helpful when it comes to learning the material. Do you study the night before and then are cramming all the information in, versus maybe you want to consider taking 15 minutes a day or 30 minutes a day to just study the material a little bit slower, at a slower pace, but over a longer period of time where you’ll retain the information a little bit better? I would just examine how you’re studying now and think about how you like to learn how you like to study and potentially change, or pivot, or enhance what you’re doing at the moment.

  I would also always recommend to stay organized. Sometimes your school will give you a school planner with the school policies, but also help you to keep track of what your homework assignments are. That’s a great way to help you prepare for whatever exams are coming up, so you can write it down and keep track of, “Okay, I should start studying on this day, or I should really start preparing, or I have this large project that’s due, so I should start a little bit sooner than I normally would have.” It’s a great way to keep you on track.

  I would also highly recommend to learn to be a self-advocate. This is something that I didn’t learn until I went into college. Don’t be afraid to talk to your teachers. I know sometimes, they’re the scary individual at the front of the classroom, or the scary teacher that you might not have a great relationship with. Just go up to them and ask them if you have a question regarding the material. Ask them to meet with you after class or at the end of the school day to go over those concepts, maybe prepare for a quiz or an exam that you have coming up. Or even ask them how they would suggest that you study for the material.

  Once you get used to having those conversations, this is going to feed into your high school experience, so you’ll feel more comfortable approaching those high school teachers that are more rigorous curriculum level. Then that will also trickle into your college experience, when you’re going to be interacting with teaching assistants or your professors and having those conversations further. Starting soon and getting you more comfortable will definitely be an awesome stepping point for your future.

  [00:21:01] BT: Yeah, I know one of the big challenges I had when going into high school was really learning how to study and being able to interact with my teachers and ask them those questions, and even send them emails and things like that.

  Speaking about those ninth and tenth grade years, I did want to ask about high school counselors. Even during the pandemic, high school counselors have been really stepping up to help students get the most out of their four years and even beyond that into college. How can ninth and tenth graders use those resources to help them prepare?

  [00:21:31] CG: Yeah, I probably alluded to those a little bit earlier, my different advice giving throughout. I would definitely say they can utilize your school counselor to help you learn about majors. Definitely go to them. As I mentioned earlier, they do have those personality and career-oriented questions or quizzes that you can utilize, that will help you get a feel for how your responses line up with potential career options. They could also just chat with you about people they know in the community relationship and help you navigate who to potentially speak to to learn more.

  As well as they can be a great resource to help you learn about colleges themselves. They are well-versed in what early decision means versus early action, or what is rolling admissions, what is early decision, as well as what’s a rural school, what is a public school. They’ll be able to talk with you about all of those different kinds of colleges that exist out there to really help you create a list and/or narrow down a list depending on whatever timeframe, ninth or tenth. They’ll be a great resource in that regard.

  Then last but not least, they are also going to be a great resource to help you with your high school curriculum and your schedule. I know when I was in high school, I had to utilize my high school counselor. That was the individual I went to when I wanted to schedule certain classes, or recommend certain classes, or have teachers recommend me for certain classes. You can have a chat with them about what classes do we offer? Do we offer any AP-level classes, which are advanced placement? Are we an IB diploma program? What does that look like for me? Are there only honors level? Do we have advanced classes?

  Just chat with them about the curriculum and then go forward in determining how you’re going to design your classes for the year, the next two years, maybe even all four years across your high school experience. They’ll be able to talk with you about what classes you might be wanting to take because of your future career goals.

  Again, if you’re interested in STEM, they can say, “All right, the science curriculum goes biology, chemistry and physics, but maybe we can bump you up to honors biology, honors chemistry and honors physics to ensure that you’re having a rigorous course load.” Those three ways are a great way to utilize them, alongside of if you ever have questions or problems, definitely utilize your school counselor too.

  [00:23:51] BW: Yeah. You just got to take the initiative and speak up and they’re going to be there to help you. That’s great advice. Finally, let’s talk about the college visit options. I know, a lot of schools during the pandemic have shifted to virtual visit options. I’m really hopeful that here in 2021, we’re going to get back to in-person visits, and open houses and all that fun stuff. What do you recommend for ninth and tenth graders wanting to start touring college campuses?

  [00:24:20] CG: Me too, Bryan. I hope that we can open up here soon. My recommendation would be, especially when you’re first starting out, choose different size colleges in different locations to visit. Whether that’s right in your backyard…I know here in Pennsylvania, we have quite a number of colleges at least within a 50-mile vicinity of where you grew up that you can go and explore.

  I would say, potentially choose a college in a urban location, so more city-oriented. Maybe choose one that’s in the suburban location, and then one that’s in a rural location, like Bucknell. This will help you get a sense of what the local community is like. You could also choose colleges that are large or small, so differing in size. For example, Penn State University Park is right about an hour away from Lewisburg, Pennsylvania, where Bucknell is. That has approximately 48,000 students. Whereas here at Bucknell, we have roughly just under 4,000 students. This will give you a different feel for what the campus feels like when there’s a lot of students, versus a little bit smaller of a campus population.

  Then once you visit all of those different places and get a feel, reflect on how you felt while you were visiting, or even how you felt on the car ride home. Is there one that stuck out to you? Did you enjoy one campus community over the other? Was the urban city orientation, what made you the most excited because of the different possibilities, or did you like the quietness of a rural campus? That will really help you guide you in your future endeavors once you’ve determined, “I really liked the urban setting, so I want to look for further colleges that are set in a urban environment or a city environment.”

  Definitely take that opportunity, even if you know you might not be interested in that school, I would say if you can, and if your parents are willing to go and visit and take you, visit a variety to really get a feel and then it will help you further down the process.

  [00:26:24] BT: Yeah. It’s really helpful, I’m sure, early on in high school to get a feel for the different settings that you might like, or what size pond that you feel comfortable and confident in. Definitely. I hope students will get to get back out there and experience all that soon.

  Well, thanks Carrine, for joining us on the podcast today. I honestly wish I had you as a resource to give me all of this great advice when I was starting out high school. Thanks so much.

  [00:26:48] BW: Yeah, I agree. This was such a great discussion and just goes to show you that the more work you put in as a ninth and tenth grader is going to help you down the road. Even if you haven’t yet started on your application itself, there’s just a lot you can do.

  If you’d like to hear more College Admissions Insider, we have episodes coming out every other Monday, so be sure to subscribe and share it with your friends.

  [00:27:08] BT: We are always looking for new topic ideas for future episodes. If you have one of those, feel free to contact us at podcast@bucknell.edu with your question, or idea that you would like us to discuss. If we use your question for an episode, we will be sure to give you a shout out as well.

  [00:27:23] BW: Oh, yeah. We’ll include your name in the episode. You’ll be famous. Finally, if you’re interested in learning more about applying to Bucknell, head to bucknell.edu/apply. Be sure to check the show notes for that link, as well as the link to some of the resources that Carrine mentioned today. We also will put a transcript in there, a link to a transcript, and even more resources for your college search.

  [00:27:46] BT: Thanks for listening to College Admissions Insider. We will see you next time.